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Revan
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Sith'ari, Chosen Heart of the Force
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| Joined: 04 Dec 2006 |
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| Location: Korriban |
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Posted: Wed Mar 12, 2008 10:19 pm Post subject: The 7 new Deadly Sins! |
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http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/7287071.stm
1.Environmental pollution
2.Genetic manipulation
3.Accumulating excessive wealth
4.Inflicting poverty
5.Drug trafficking and consumption
6.Morally debatable experiments
7.Violation of fundamental rights of human nature
lol. They're trying to be hip, modern, and relevant.
Do they work for you, or do you think it'll be a flop? Sound off peeps!
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Words are the only bullets in truth's bandolier. And poets are the snipers.
-George Wu (The Hyperion Cantos, Dan Simmons) |
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supertotoy
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Old Dragon
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| Location: Limbo |
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Posted: Wed Mar 12, 2008 10:37 pm Post subject: |
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Still liked the old ones better... Nothing fundamental in human nature has changed anyway. So the old ones could still work, in a sense. For example, we could classify 1,2 and 6 as pride (since they were caused by human arrogance, setting oneself above God by altering His design, etc...). The old ones were more general, and these ones are just more specific about the detail of the sins.
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Master Wayne, you've just been PWNED! |
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Revan
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Sith'ari, Chosen Heart of the Force
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Posted: Wed Mar 12, 2008 10:43 pm Post subject: |
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Funny, I happen to think that genetic engineering is the hope for a galactic wide explosion of a multitude of trans-human species...or perhaps I've been reading too much of Dan Simmons' Hyperion Cantos...but that's just me.
1. is more an offshoot of gluttony, imho.
_________________
Words are the only bullets in truth's bandolier. And poets are the snipers.
-George Wu (The Hyperion Cantos, Dan Simmons) |
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Xtian
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Goderator
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| Joined: 30 Nov 2006 |
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| Location: Avernus |
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Posted: Wed Mar 12, 2008 11:49 pm Post subject: |
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Old deadly sins list is more of personal sins while this new list is more of social sins so it is no surprise that this new list is fundamentally the same as the oldies.
But then again, the old deadly sins will send me to hell while these sins will not, though they won't make me a saint or guarantee a place in heaven either.
_________________
solbergb on sorcerers:
"Whether it is true or not, all sorcerers seem to act as if their power is inexhaustible. It really annoys the prepared casters."
A druid on rogue:
"Foolish girl! I am a Druid, I have special abilities more powerful than your entire class!" |
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princessa
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Goddess
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| Location: denial |
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Posted: Sat Mar 15, 2008 12:25 pm Post subject: |
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Seven More Sins, Thanks to Vatican
1. “Bioethical” violations such as birth control
2. “Morally dubious” experiments such as stem cell research
3. Drug abuse
4. Polluting the environment
5. Contributing to widening divide between rich and poor
6. Excessive wealth
7. Creating poverty
Hmm... isn't overpopulation (i.e. not using birth control) a major player in POVERTY? Birth control is NOT the same as abortion. Abortion would probably guarantee a one-way ticket to heck.
"Morally dubious". Who decides what's moral? Oh, wait *forehead slap* of course, the church! You're damned if you do, damned if you don't. So just go for it.
Excessive wealth and contributing to widening divide between rich and poor... I'm sorry it's a dog-eat-dog world out there. You can't cope? Tough.
As far as I can tell, everyone's still going to heck whether they have seven deadly sins or seven thousand deadly sins.
Besides, you can always justify your actions.
And if SEVEN is still too great a number... there's always that ONE rule, right? Go back to basics. "Do unto others what you want done unto you." or something to that effect.
_________________
Expected, really.
D&D Home Page - What Class Are You? - Build A Character - D&D Compendium |
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Xtian
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Goderator
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Posted: Sat Mar 15, 2008 1:57 pm Post subject: |
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Acid Blue
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Old Dragon
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Posted: Wed Mar 19, 2008 2:17 pm Post subject: |
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personally I prefer the old school 7
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let M = number of ninja and N = Ninjitsu Level, then N takes the general form of N = a/(bM)^c |
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Xtian
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Goderator
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Posted: Thu Mar 20, 2008 2:54 am Post subject: |
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Which does not matter anyway since to the Church, no one is innocent. Aside from the 10 commandments, we have the old sins and now, modern sins list for modern times. Aside from that, we are born with original sin inherited from our forefathers. Not able to go to church because of work? That's a sin! Thinking of sex? No u! That's a ticket to hell. We are committing sins everyday even if we don't feel it and the only way to wash away these goddamn sins is to go to church and confess. I am very sure that you've been in a dilemma where either path lead to a sin. You need church. Church is the word of God. Questioning the church is questioning God himself and because of that you go straight to hell.
Contributing to widening divide between rich and poor? Heh, once you start working your guilty of this, because you earn money and the poor people don't and this leads to.... Creating poverty. That's two sins already people for studying and working hard... I also hope that this Creating poverty involves those who people from poor area whose past time involve making babies and blaming the government for their status. We could encourage birth control but... it is a sin! Sin if you let them have babies and still if you control them. Gaaah... Like princessa said, damned if you do, damned if you don't. And also... more people means more pollution. Planning to have a child? It is a sin in the making, I tell you. But wait! Isn't it God told us in the book of Genesis to populate and populate? Oh no! I'm questioning the church! I'm pretty sure I'm going to hell now! Wait, I'll convert to another religion while there's still time.
Bottom line is... everyone is guilty. No one is innocent. So ... Have you guys decided on which layer of hell you plan to stay eternity?
_________________
solbergb on sorcerers:
"Whether it is true or not, all sorcerers seem to act as if their power is inexhaustible. It really annoys the prepared casters."
A druid on rogue:
"Foolish girl! I am a Druid, I have special abilities more powerful than your entire class!" |
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oghma
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Ancient Dragon
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Posted: Thu Mar 20, 2008 3:03 am Post subject: |
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Xtian
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Goderator
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Posted: Thu Mar 20, 2008 3:20 am Post subject: |
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BJ
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He Who Founds Wyrmlings
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Posted: Thu Mar 20, 2008 11:47 am Post subject: |
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| ORGASM wrote: | Organizational Rules, Guidelines, and Such Matters
1. Be respectful.
a. Do not attack another person's religion. |
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Revan
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Sith'ari, Chosen Heart of the Force
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Posted: Thu Mar 20, 2008 2:20 pm Post subject: |
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To reiterate BJ's point, this was setup for discussion, not Church bashing. Xtian's points are interesting, but could have been more...politely worded.
Examine the issues. What do you think about these new 'sins' and discuss them. Don't just leave one-liner comments or use these as an attack platform. (Or if it might be interpretable as an attack platform, explain why your comments aren't)
_________________
Words are the only bullets in truth's bandolier. And poets are the snipers.
-George Wu (The Hyperion Cantos, Dan Simmons) |
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Xtian
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Goderator
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Posted: Thu Mar 20, 2008 2:41 pm Post subject: |
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| BJ wrote: | | ORGASM wrote: | Organizational Rules, Guidelines, and Such Matters
1. Be respectful.
a. Do not attack another person's religion. |
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| ORGASM also wrote: | | b. Do not minimod. Moderating is the moderators job. Do not steal it from them. |
And also, hurt by my emotive tone of my post? Emotive sentences have no bearing on discussions if you don't know that. You should at least see the sense of it and not become so defensive.
I am not attacking any religion. More accurately, I am pointing out the church's strategy of "no-one-is-innocent-and-you-can-only-find-your-salvation-from-us" and "damned-if-you-do-damned-if-you-dont" tactic.
_________________
solbergb on sorcerers:
"Whether it is true or not, all sorcerers seem to act as if their power is inexhaustible. It really annoys the prepared casters."
A druid on rogue:
"Foolish girl! I am a Druid, I have special abilities more powerful than your entire class!" |
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BJ
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He Who Founds Wyrmlings
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Posted: Thu Mar 20, 2008 3:08 pm Post subject: |
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Ah. Am not minimodding, if that is the concern. I am implying that I am seeing the direction as leading to a possible attack on my religion, and as such we should proceed with caution. I am so far not offended, Xtian's opinions are his own. And I do believe his points are mature.
But you see, we have been getting an influx of immature posts recently. Not from the moderators, certainly, but rather from the newer blood. I am simply concerned that one of them might inappropriately post here.
Case in point, the Church in question is my religion. Feel free to discuss these new sins, but once an attack comes, I will respectfully ask the Goderator for decisive action.
My only request, for now, is to give this thread an adult tag. |
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oghma
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Ancient Dragon
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Posted: Thu Mar 20, 2008 3:13 pm Post subject: |
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Touche, but still, no matter how many sins are mandated by the Church, it's all up to the person to go with what he bwe don't question our beliefs once in a while, skepticism is important for the elieves in. It would all go to moot if continuity of intelligent and free conversation. I for one believe that it doesn't matter if we sin or not, as long as the good we do outweigh the bad things we have done, we could still get some measure of rest in the afterlife.
_________________
"I should mug people to this song. I'll get so many silver points." -Random youtuber
"LOL! If someone mugged me while this song was playing, I would know that they meant business. " -another random youtuber |
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Xtian
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Goderator
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Posted: Thu Mar 20, 2008 3:26 pm Post subject: |
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BJ
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He Who Founds Wyrmlings
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Posted: Thu Mar 20, 2008 3:30 pm Post subject: |
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Back to topic, I myself disagree to these "new" sins. As princessa pointed out, two of them (Birth Control, Creating Poverty) already contradict each other to an extent.
That is why I have decided to be a free-form Catholic. These new laws the Church impose? I'll sleep easier if I consider them as more like guidelines.
Why don't i go to Church regularly? The Priest's opinions are just that; opinions of an individual. I will still go to Church, but I will worship as I see fit. Not going is no sin.
Sex? Oh come on. Love thy neighbor! The problem with sex is the idea that you will hurt someone (the fcuk then leave problem), but we have been given our own conscience. We do not need the Church for that.
As for the impending damnation, the Church does not decide who gets into the Heavenly gates; the Lord does. The best they can do is instruct. They cannot make new sins. that is what they forget at times. |
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princessa
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Goddess
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| Location: denial |
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Posted: Thu Mar 20, 2008 3:42 pm Post subject: |
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6. Excessive wealth
Waitaminute....the CHURCH is one of the wealthiest entities on this planet.
Guess they forgot THAT.
I'm not a very religious person, but I do acknowledge the sanctity of some things to some groups of people.
_________________
Expected, really.
D&D Home Page - What Class Are You? - Build A Character - D&D Compendium |
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Pitz-Ikko
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D' Original Henio
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| Location: Abu Dhabi |
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Posted: Mon Mar 24, 2008 4:33 pm Post subject: Re: The 7 new Deadly Sins! |
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| Revan wrote: | 1.Environmental pollution
2.Genetic manipulation
3.Accumulating excessive wealth
4.Inflicting poverty
5.Drug trafficking and consumption
6.Morally debatable experiments
7.Violation of fundamental rights of human nature |
I don't understand (forgive me, I'm not Catholic), so help me out here. Do these New 7 supercede the Old 7? Or do they combine to become the Ultimate 14?
Why is "morally debatable experiment" a sin? Is it not "innocent until proven guilty"? Being "debatable" puts you in a gray area - you can't simply push it towards the other side!
And watch out, guys! No. 1: Environmental Pollution. Did you know that too much methane in the atmosphere can cause silent death? So, plug a stopper on it until you can...release...it into a disposable can. 
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A little surprising, really...
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Pitz-Ikko
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D' Original Henio
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Posted: Mon Mar 24, 2008 4:40 pm Post subject: |
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| princessa wrote: | 1. “Bioethical” violations such as birth control
2. “Morally dubious” experiments such as stem cell research
3. Drug abuse
4. Polluting the environment
5. Contributing to widening divide between rich and poor
6. Excessive wealth
7. Creating poverty |
Same points as I've said above. "Morally debatable" simply reworded into "morally dubious", which can't be a sin by its very meaning.
Excessive wealth? Polluting the environment? Drug abuse? That's just one category split into three: Excess! Excess riches, excess waste, excess drug use. I'd call that cheating - can't quite fill out the 7 slots so split some to get some.
Creating poverty, contributing to the widening divide. Hmm. I guess you'd have to blame the Chinese for inventing corruption (quoting Madam Defensor-Santiago).
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A little surprising, really...
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BJ
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He Who Founds Wyrmlings
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Posted: Mon Mar 24, 2008 4:42 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | The Vatican has brought up to date the traditional seven deadly sins by adding seven modern mortal sins it claims are becoming prevalent in what it calls an era of "unstoppable globalisation". |
I think they're adding, not replacing.
Pretty soon we'll have 777 Deadly sins, and you have to cross-reference a chart to see if your next action is a sin.
I tell you, freeform is best for the soul.
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Nosfecatu Publishing |
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Xtian
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Goderator
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Posted: Mon Mar 24, 2008 5:29 pm Post subject: |
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@Pitz
Look at my post above. In roman catholic, no one is innocent; people with either go to hell or admit that they are sinners and seek redemption that can only be found on the goddamn church.
@BJ
No need for the goddamn charts! Yer guilty anyway so do it!
However, deadly sin or not we still have to comply with laws of the society. Being an atheist is not an excuse to commit genocide.
On the afterlife, I am more of a apatheist.
_________________
solbergb on sorcerers:
"Whether it is true or not, all sorcerers seem to act as if their power is inexhaustible. It really annoys the prepared casters."
A druid on rogue:
"Foolish girl! I am a Druid, I have special abilities more powerful than your entire class!" |
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Pitz-Ikko
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D' Original Henio
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Posted: Tue Mar 25, 2008 1:15 pm Post subject: |
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| Xtian wrote: | @Pitz
Look at my post above. In roman catholic, no one is innocent; people with either go to hell or admit that they are sinners and seek redemption that can only be found on the goddamn church. |
Actually, no one can be saved. Every religion claims that they are the only way out and that all others are phony. If they are all true, then they are all phonies! See y'all in Hell, boys. I hope they've got a fridge there - I think I'd want an ice-cold Coke down there every now & then. 
_________________
A little surprising, really...
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teacher_dum
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Young Adult Dragon
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Posted: Fri May 02, 2008 8:23 am Post subject: |
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According to LaVey, the Church selected the 7 Deadly Sins because those things are qualities inherent in a person. Pride, Wrath, Lechery, Sloth, Gluttony, Avarice, and something else are all human characteristics which are unavoidable. They are, in essence, what makes us human. So if they are unavoidable, and they are viewed as sins, then people are sinners.
Sinners. According to the Church.
The Church needs sinners. Without sinners who seek salvation the Church ceases to function. After all, the afterlife is the only bargaining chip they have left.
LaVey's a pretty articulate guy, if you can get past the Satanism thing. He used Satan not in the Judeo-Christian sense, but in the literal Hebrew for 'adversary'. As in opponent. Of the Church. I disagree with all his magic and rituals and stuff, but philosophically he makes sense.
_________________
By the Power of Truth, I, while living, have conquered the Universe!
-Faust
The strong take from the weak, but the smart take from the strong.
-The Rule of Four
Man's ego is the fountainhead of human progress.
-Ayn Rand |
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dark_axis
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Eternal Elan
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| Location: 666th Layer of Hell |
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Posted: Tue Jun 10, 2008 11:32 pm Post subject: |
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i will comment on this later.... will just take my break for now..
_________________
Only by confronting your darkest fears can you find the light...
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dark_axis
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Eternal Elan
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| Location: 666th Layer of Hell |
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Posted: Tue Jun 10, 2008 11:55 pm Post subject: |
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I was born as a catholic and raised as one. But has never understood the "teachings" of the church. When I say teachings, I mean their rulings, their sides and their opinions. As what I remember from the bible, the church should not in anyway mingle in politics but most of their rulings right now are political and mostly contradict what the government stands for. Also I remeber that in the bible there is also a part there that there is an authority that is given to the government to rule or to dictate what is best for its citizen but unfortunately the church strictly contradicts to our laws. First concern would be for abortion and family planning, for abortion I do side on the church that it is not legal and unfit as an act of a human being. But even for family planning the church contradicts birth control which is a way to avoid abortion. Next is excessive wealth, it has always bothered me that the church has always asks for donations in every mass but as far as i am concerned I don't see the logic why " ten percent of your salary should be given as donations" nor do I see where my money goes to. Bioethical is another thing, ethical is dictated by man and we can never know what God's opinion is to what is ethical or not. I'll think of more...
_________________
Only by confronting your darkest fears can you find the light...
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